Normalize-Then-Precondition: A Hierarchical Approach to Marginal Scale and Interaction Geometry for LLM Training
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Abstract (arXiv)
Matrix optimizers have emerged as a promising direction, with Muon standing out as a prominent design. Revisiting Muon through its full-Gram representation, we observe that it jointly processes marginal-scale and interaction information. This opens an alternative way to organize geometric information hierarchically, motivating the Normalize-Then-Precondition framework. Specifically, it first uses diagonal-Gram information to construct a marginally normalized update, then applies spectral preconditioning to its directional interaction geometry. Building on this framework, we develop NormPre with NormPre-G and NormPre-L adopting global and localized spectral preconditioning, grounded in spectral-norm steepest descent and a regularized formulation followed by leading mode selection, respectively. To enable large-scale training, NormPre-G uses Newton-Schulz iterations and NormPre-L employs randomized sketching to approximate the leading interaction eigenspace. Theoretically, we establish O(T-1/2) convergence guarantees for simplified versions of NormPre. Across extensive pretraining experiments on GPT-2 Small, LLaMA and Qwen3, both variants consistently outperform AdamW, Muon and MANO under matched training budgets. Further efficiency and spectral analyses reveal the complementary strengths of two variants and characterize their performance-efficiency trade-off. We open-source our code through a GitHub repository at https://github.com/zx-gong/NormPre.
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References · 24
- 2019Exploring the Limits of Transfer Learning with a Unified Text-to-Text Transformercited by 14,599
- 2023LLaMA: Open and Efficient Foundation Language Modelscited by 14,132
- 2025Qwen3 Technical Reportcited by 8,820
- 2020The Pile: An 800GB Dataset of Diverse Text for Language Modelingcited by 2,411
- 2015Optimizing Neural Networks with Kronecker-factored Approximate Curvaturecited by 796
- 2024GaLore: Memory-Efficient LLM Training by Gradient Low-Rank Projectioncited by 463
- 2023Symbolic Discovery of Optimization Algorithmscited by 434
- 2025Muon is Scalable for LLM Trainingcited by 428
- 2018Shampoo: Preconditioned Stochastic Tensor Optimizationcited by 426
- 2023Sophia: A Scalable Stochastic Second-order Optimizer for Language Model Pre-trainingcited by 265
- 2024Old Optimizer, New Norm: An Anthologycited by 193
- 2025Training Deep Learning Models with Norm-Constrained LMOscited by 192
12 more
- 2024Adam-mini: Use Fewer Learning Rates To Gain Morecited by 137
- 2025NorMuon: Making Muon more efficient and scalablecited by 84
- 2023A Distributed Data-Parallel PyTorch Implementation of the Distributed Shampoo Optimizer for Training Neural Networks At-Scalecited by 77
- 2025AdaMuon: Adaptive Muon Optimizercited by 67
- 2024Cautious Optimizers: Improving Training with One Line of Codecited by 47
- 2026Controlled LLM Training on Spectral Spherecited by 31
- 2025The Sharpness Disparity Principle in Transformers for Accelerating Language Model Pre-Trainingcited by 30
- 2024SWAN: SGD with Normalization and Whitening Enables Stateless LLM Trainingcited by 20
- 2026MuonEq: Balancing Before Orthogonalization with Lightweight Equilibrationcited by 17
- 2026RMNP: Row-Momentum Normalized Preconditioning for Scalable Matrix-Based Optimizationcited by 15
- 2026Mano: Restriking Manifold Optimization for LLM Trainingcited by 12
- 2026On the Width Scaling of Neural Optimizers Under Matrix Operator Norms I: Row/Column Normalization and Hyperparameter Transfercited by 12
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