Beyond the Matrix Sign: Quadratic Spectral Descent
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Abstract (arXiv)
Muon emerges as a strong competitor of the AdamW for LLM pretraining, because the matrix-wise update it employs can potentially incur smaller second-order penalty than the once dominating AdamW, which performs coordinate-wise update. However, the spectral flattening procedure in Muon is quite debatable since it discards the spectral amplitude information totally. To seek for better spectral allocation (and the associated spectral subspace), we propose to solve the quadratic model of loss function under the spectral norm constraint textitdirectly (i.e., in a genuinely Newtonian way) and thus obtaining the Quadratic Spectral Descent (QSD) algorithm. In contrast, many existing curvature-aware methods either exploit the second-order information in an textitimplicit way by changing the weight update geometry (such as Mousse, FISMO) or rely on strong assumptions (such as the weight displacement isotropy assumption in Newton-Muon). QSD's potential advantage over these methods is best illustrated in the isotropic curvature scenario, where Mousse, FISMO and Newton-Muon all reduce to Muon while the spectral allocation in QSD is still textitnon-flat (since the spectral allocation in QSD depends on the textitgradient to curvature ratio). Meanwhile, to control the complexity of QSD, we employ inversion-free K-FAC and textitonline Frank-Wolfe update which is essentially a matrix sign operator. Overall, the complexity increase can be rather mild. Experiments on GPT pre-training show that QSD consistently improves validation loss over Muon and recent Muon variants, while achieving up to an 8.49% wall-clock speedup at matched validation loss.
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References · 27
- 2020Scaling Laws for Neural Language Modelscited by 6,411
- 2022Training Compute-Optimal Large Language Modelscited by 2,927
- 2024The FineWeb Datasets: Decanting the Web for the Finest Text Data at Scalecited by 1,104
- 2015Optimizing Neural Networks with Kronecker-factored Approximate Curvaturecited by 776
- 2018Shampoo: Preconditioned Stochastic Tensor Optimizationcited by 413
- 2025Muon is Scalable for LLM Trainingcited by 381
- 2019Limitations of the Empirical Fisher Approximation for Natural Gradient Descentcited by 213
- 2025Training Deep Learning Models with Norm-Constrained LMOscited by 177
- 2024Old Optimizer, New Norm: An Anthologycited by 173
- 2018Fast Approximate Natural Gradient Descent in a Kronecker-factored Eigenbasiscited by 143
- 2025The Polar Express: Optimal Matrix Sign Methods and Their Application to the Muon Algorithmcited by 104
- 2025Fantastic Pretraining Optimizers and Where to Find Themcited by 87
15 more
- 2025Practical Efficiency of Muon for Pretrainingcited by 74
- 2025NorMuon: Making Muon more efficient and scalablecited by 74
- 2025Gluon: Making Muon & Scion Great Again! (Bridging Theory and Practice of LMO-based Optimizers for LLMs)cited by 66
- 2024A New Perspective on Shampoo's Preconditionercited by 54
- 2025Isotropic Curvature Model for Understanding Deep Learning Optimization: Is Gradient Orthogonalization Optimal?cited by 30
- 2025An Exploration of Non-Euclidean Gradient Descent: Muon and its Many Variantscited by 25
- 2026Mousse: Rectifying the Geometry of Muon with Curvature-Aware Preconditioningcited by 15
- 2026The Newton-Muon Optimizercited by 14
- 2026HTMuon: Improving Muon via Heavy-Tailed Spectral Correctioncited by 11
- 2026FISMO: Fisher-Structured Momentum-Orthogonalized Optimizercited by 10
- 2025Preconditioned Norms: A Unified Framework for Steepest Descent, Quasi-Newton and Adaptive Methodscited by 9
- 2026Why Muon Outperforms Adam: A Curvature Perspectivecited by 4
- 2026DynMuon: A Dynamic Spectral Shaping View of Muoncited by 2
- 2026Second-Order Muon Done Right: A Principled Marriage of Spectral Geometry and Curvaturecited by 1
- 2026Spectral Allocation: Why Muon Outperforms Adam, and How to Improve Muoncited by 1
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