mlsanityData to 14 Oct 2026

Derivative-Free Structured Updates for Muon

arXiv 2609.17759 ↗First posted 15 Sep 2026math.OC cs.LGcited by 0

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Abstract (arXiv)

Muon updates matrix-valued neural-network parameters by orthogonalizing a gradient-based momentum matrix. Its reliance on derivatives limits its use when gradients are unavailable or unreliable. We develop a derivative-free framework that constructs Muon-style updates from structured finite differences. Four variants are considered: full entrywise recovery, random low-rank surrogates, basis-aligned rank-one probing, and direct structured search. Exhaustive basis-aligned probing is equivalent, up to positive scaling before ideal polar orthogonalization, to coordinate finite differences. Matrix-regression experiments show that random rank-one probing can reduce the number of function evaluations substantially, at the cost of less accurate updates. Controlled noisy-gradient experiments on regression and a neural network illustrate when accurate function values can compensate for an unreliable gradient oracle. A small CartPole study further examines orthogonal rank-one probes under a fixed episode budget. These results support structured probing as a practical option for selected black-box problems; they do not establish a general convergence guarantee or an advantage over accurate, inexpensive gradients.

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References · 5

  1. 2025Muon is Scalable for LLM Trainingcited by 428
  2. 2025Muon Optimizes Under Spectral Norm Constraintscited by 86
  3. 2025A Note on the Convergence of Muoncited by 83
  4. 2025Isotropic Curvature Model for Understanding Deep Learning Optimization: Is Gradient Orthogonalization Optimal?cited by 37
  5. 2023A New Two-dimensional Model-based Subspace Method for Large-scale Unconstrained Derivative-free Optimization: 2D-MoSubcited by 2

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